Grief in Their Words: Voices That understand Child Loss -E441

Sometimes another person's words express exactly what our hearts have been trying to say.

In this special episode, Bruce and Kristin step away from the traditional interview format to share writings and reflections from several remarkable voices in the grief community, including Jameson Arasi, Paula Griffith, Donna Ashworth, and The Grief Table.

Together, they explore powerful themes including why grief is a lifelong expression of love, how grief and joy can exist together, the difference between memories and missing, learning to "move with" grief rather than trying to move on, and why speaking our children's names keeps their presence alive.

More than a discussion about inspirational quotes, this conversation is an invitation to discover resources that may bring comfort, validation, and hope—whether your loss is recent or decades old.

If you've ever struggled to find words for your grief, this episode may help you find them.

Because while grief changes shape, love never disappears. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:10

Welcome to Don't Forget to Breathe. I'm Bruce Barker here with my co-host, Kristen Glenn. You know, every once in a while, someone puts words to grief in a way that makes you stop. Take a breath and think, yes, that's exactly what I've been trying to say. Today's episode, it's a little different. Instead of interviewing a guest, Kristen and I are sharing some of the writers, poets, and grief advocates, many of whom are bereaved parents themselves, whose words have deeply impacted our own journeys. Through

Why Words Matter In Grief

SPEAKER_03 0:45

Instagram pages, poetry, and reflections, they've captured truths about child loss that many bereavents feel, but often struggle to express. We'll read some of their writings, talk about what resonates with us, and explore why these messages matter, not only for grieving parents, but also for anyone walking beside someone they love. If you're grieving, we hope you'll hear your own heart reflected in these words. And if you're supporting someone who is grieving, we hope these words will help you understand just a little more. Let's take a breath together and begin. I am doing great.

SPEAKER_00 1:32

That's good.

SPEAKER_03 1:33

Hey, so I know we've talked about this for a while off air, and we've kind of shared some of the things that we have seen on Instagram. And I know we're you actually in particular are working on our Instagram page for the Don't Forget to Breathe podcast. And, you know, in doing some of the stuff with social media, I've come across some really good sites or pages, I guess is what would be a better word for it. And there's been some really profound things that I've seen. And I know you and I've talked about it. So what we're talking about tonight is we want to share some of those with our listeners where they came from. And, you know, maybe it's it's pages that you want to follow. We're going to talk about some of the things. There's some real insight. And I know in a previous podcast we talk about how important it is to be around those people that get it. Well, the people we're going to talk about and the things that we're going to read from their Instagram pages are people that get it. You know, we'll just kind of read through, you know, read through them and then and just kind of see where it lands, see what, you know, where it comes from. There's a page, it's Jameson Orasi. I believe that's the correct pronunciation. But the Instagram, you know, it's at Jamison Arassi, so it's J-A-M-E-S-O-N-A-R-A-S-I. Great suggestion on following that. Incredible writing, just incredible post. One of the things that I want to share, and then we'll we'll talk about it, is he says, Yes, you will grieve forever. Not as a life sentence,

Grieving Forever As A Love Letter

SPEAKER_03 3:16

but as a love letter, you keep writing.

SPEAKER_02 3:21

Where's that hit you?

SPEAKER_00 3:24

I love that. The love letter, you keep writing. I just think that's such a it's such a compassionate way to view our grief for ourselves that you and I've talked about the way we live is the the way we try to express our love now for our children. I think that it feels like a life sentence. And it is. But it is one of love, not of punishment. You know, when we think of a life sentence, I think I felt like that in the beginning, like I will forever be punished for not being able to somehow prevent this from happening. So I will live a life of sorrow. And now I just really do not believe that anymore. So both him saying it not a life sentence and also the phrase, it's a forever love letter, I think is just poetic for lack of a better word.

SPEAKER_03 4:33

Yeah, it really is. I mean, I know early on I went to a couple of groups and and this was again within the first few months, and I go in and I'm hearing people tell their stories, and just they're completely distraught. And I remember in one case, this person that was sharing it, a young mother, and was just, you know, obviously devastated. And then the facilitator asked, and remind me how long it's been. And she said, 16 years. Or it could have been 12, I don't know, but a long time. And I'm like, oh my gosh, I am so screwed. Like this, this is what it is. So at that time, I did, I'm thinking, well, I'm gonna, I'm gonna grieve forever. And yeah, it's a life sentence of sadness.

SPEAKER_00 5:26

Right.

SPEAKER_03 5:27

But through time and and a lot of work and therapy and conversations, realizing she was simply in her moment. She was feeling her feels, and that's where those emotions were coming from. And as you and I have talked about, the grief is always going to be there, but the grief and the joy can coexist at the same time. And I didn't understand that then. It just seemed like it was this is a life sentence. This is just gonna be, it's gonna be this every day. But I also know that when I've had those conversations with people, and you and I, um, I'm sure this has both happened to both of us, when you feel the emotion in recalling something, um, recalling a memory, or maybe what what we've lost or a future or whatever, and there's emotion there, that it's okay to feel that emotion, and that's not a bad thing. So that's not a you're not stuck in that emotional feeling forever. And and he addresses this in two simple sentences.

SPEAKER_02 6:39

Yes, you will grieve forever, not as a life sentence, but as a love letter you keep writing. How about you share one with me?

SPEAKER_00 6:51

There's a truth about grief that love doesn't stop, it just loses its usual way of moving through the world. It can't crow travel through a phone call anymore, it can't show up at the door, it can't sit across from you at dinner, so it finds another way. It lives in who you are becoming, the way you listen more closely, offer kindness without question, the way you love people differently now, because you know in a way that you never did before exactly what it means to lose them.

SPEAKER_03 7:32

Yeah. Grief is interesting. You know, there's there's podcasts, so many podcasts on grief. There's obviously so many Instagram pages, there's blogs, there's books. Because I think it's something that we continue to learn and dive into deeper, especially those who experience this level of loss. But that, you know, that first line, because here's the truth about grief the love doesn't stop. And yeah, it changes, it takes on a new identity. I love his insight. Like I say, it's not the it's not what it used to be. It just, but it finds another way. And he points that out.

unknown 8:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:19

I love how it's not the tangible ways that you want it. I talk to so many parents, and they want that hug, they want that voice, they want that physical presence. We all do. And then that he just quite simply says it it just finds another way. And if it if we allow it to, it finds another way through our way of living, because we are able to do those tangible things of showing up, sitting next to, listening, loving, talking. So I think that I think that's beautiful.

SPEAKER_03 8:53

You know that it's the the part he mentioned is about who you are becoming, because we know there's an evolution there. And he points out you listen more closely. 100%. Offer kindness without question, because we know that we don't know what where someone else is.

SPEAKER_01 9:14

Right.

SPEAKER_03 9:16

Because we experienced it, that someone doesn't know what we're what we're going through, and if they were asking us questions or they were doing something with with some judgment or assuming something, we know what that feels like. So we don't we turn around and we don't do that and just simply offer without question. Yeah. Jameson is onto some stuff here. Here's another one from him. Every time we talk about them, we carry them into the present. We close the distance between then and now, between memory and missing. That one really hit me when I when I first read that.

SPEAKER_00 10:01

Yeah, and can I refer back to an episode that we did about sibling loss? And that episode, a teenager reflected on losing his younger brother. And he, if anyone's looking for that episode, it's just Cooper's story. But I was struck by the fact that he talked about the memories that he shared with his brother and those memories being difficult because he wishes he could redo those memories. Was he too tough on him? Did he not appreciate enough? And then just in that wisdom that he shared, he went right on to talking about the missing of ever becoming an uncle, the missing of ever getting to see his brother grow up. So without any prompting, this, you know, wise teenager that we were able to have the honor to interview, I was just struck by that. I'd never really thought of that before in those terms of the the memory shifting to the missing. And I think, you know, as the years have passed, the memories have faded. The the the acute memories of my son and exactly what he sounded like, or the feel of his hand in mine, or his giggle, or how he smelled right after bath. I don't I know it was precious, I know it was special, but I don't I couldn't pick it out. And that that's that's devastating. But I think it just it is, it is what that is. And now it's really shifted to this missing, this longing. You know, his brother now got married, and there was this longing for me to see another groomsman up there. And it's been decades, and I never thought it would strike me like that. Because I never knew him as an adult, but it did. It shifted to not a memory, but just a sheer missing and a void.

SPEAKER_03 12:03

You know, we and we talked about it in another episode that was directed more toward those that are supporting someone who had a loss. And one of the things that we brought up was about saying their name, bringing up a memory, talking about them. And Jameson's covered it here. Every time we talk about them, we carry them into the present.

SPEAKER_00 12:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:25

Right? We close that distance. You know, like you said, while some of those memories may not be as sharp as they used to be, they're now in the present. And now that's another form where we're missing them. Because by having conversations about them, speaking their name, we brought them into the present. So now we miss them. So beautifully done. One last one from him, and then we're and we're gonna talk about something else, but this one is really good. And and this falls into even some of the episodes we've done before. And this one is so let the tears fall when they come. Let the laughter rise when memories bring warmth. Let grief and joy coexist. They are not opposites, they are just love and different forms.

SPEAKER_00 13:18

No words from me. I think you know.

SPEAKER_03 13:20

Yeah, it's like that one kind of goes without yeah, really just it's about being present. That's really it, is about being present in the moment, feeling your feels, and that grief and joy are gonna walk hand in hand as we go forward. Yeah. Those are some quotes from Jamison Arassi, and again, that is on Instagram. It's like at Jamison Arassi. So that's all one word. So it's J-A-M-E-S-O-N-A-R-A-S-I. Jameson, thank you for sharing your grief with everyone. Okay, so there is um there's a couple of sites, and it and it's um, I believe it's by the same person, but one is, and again, some of our listeners, you may be following these pages anyway. Uh, but the grieving moms, that's all one word. And that's also by, I believe, Paula P. Griffith. So the other site is at P period, P period Griffith, G-R-I-F-F I T H. And she

Getting Acquainted With Grief

SPEAKER_03 14:39

has some incredible writings that are in there. Kristen, you want to share one of those?

SPEAKER_00 14:45

Yeah, I love one that talks about being acquainted with grief. It says you do not get over the loss of someone you love, you get acquainted with it. Modern grief theory has moved away from the old five-stage model because grief is not a checklist, it's a relationship. You learn its rhythms, you learn how to hold it on good days, and how to let it hold you on bad days. And somewhere in the holding, you find yourself again.

SPEAKER_02 15:17

That's amazing.

SPEAKER_00 15:20

It truly is. The you hold it on the good days, and you let it hold you on the bad days.

SPEAKER_03 15:29

You know, depending on where you are in your journey, that may be hard to that may be hard to swallow. And again, it depends on also are are you aligned with the five stages? And I think I've talked about that in episodes way back. How that doesn't align with me. And I think I referred to it more as a river. Or maybe I haven't shared that. Don't know. Either way, this is I love the getting acquainted with it. Getting acquainted with the grief. And that it's a relationship.

unknown 16:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:09

We did a letter writing reflection at a mother's retreat fairly recently, and the moms chose between writing to their child or writing or writing a letter to grief. Wow. And we wrote I think almost all of the nine moms in attendance wrote to grief as their companion, as what they wanted to say to grief. And some of those letters held anger, and some of them held acknowledgement that grief was the package of love that they felt. They love and grieve deeply. They have to coexist after the loss of your child. But but to address grief, it was really powerful. And we we read, if we wanted to, our letters, but they're, you know, dear grief. And then what do you want to say to your grief? It may be a worthy thing to consider.

SPEAKER_03 17:08

Yeah, I would like to, you know, and and at some point in the future, if if we have if one of those moms is willing to come on to an episode to be willing to read that, because I'm certainly curious about that. And I'm sure a lot of listeners are. It would be really good for people to share and get others opinions and and places where they are on their journey and how to look at this. There's another writing that Paula has offered, and this one really resonated with me. And and I'm pretty sure that I talked about this in an early episode about this particular moment, but it but what she writes is some mornings feel normal for a split second, and then the reality settles in all over again. The kind of reality your heart still refuses to fully accept. Losing Chanel, that's her daughter, changed the way I wake up, the way I breathe, the way I move through this world. It's not just missing her, it's living with the truth that no amount of love, no amount of wishing, no amount of what ifs can bring her back. And yet, I still get up. I still carry her with me. I still learn how to live with a heart that will never be the same. You know, I talked about that for the the very next morning after I received the call about Kristen dying. Was there that split second between being in a dream and being fully conscious, I felt for that split second, oh, that was just a terrible nightmare. But before I could even complete the thought, I was awake and I was back into reality.

unknown 19:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:06

I think that's the parents that I've talked to, and you can tell me if that's the same for you. That's a common feeling. It's a common thing that happens. And and I love the way that that Paula has written this to share it.

SPEAKER_00 19:23

I think that's what makes mourning so difficult sometimes, because it is this a bit of reprieve that your psyche gets if you're able to sleep, which grief can certainly be disruptive to any sort of normal sleep patterns, but any amount of reprieve of the mind resting, and then that wake up time of oh, this is this is my reality. I think when she says, I s and yet I still get up, even as you realize it is real. The resiliency it just is it's inspiring to watch people I've worked with still get up and remember that they're carrying their child with them and learning how to live again, and it's it's incredible to me. And I I think sometimes we feel the human nature would be well, then you don't get out of bed. But that's not what I see bereaved parents doing. They get out of bed, they figure it out, they want to live in ways that honor their children, and they are the most incredible humans I've I've met.

SPEAKER_03 20:38

Yeah, I I know I say fairly early on. Once I got to know some other parents, and these were just this was before I was doing any of this, and it just happened to be that I knew someone and then they lost a child, and then someone else. And I remember I'm sorry, every loss is unique, and we don't compare, but I did. One of the moms that I talked to, she had three other children, and Kristen was my only child. And my thing for her was and I'd said is like, you don't have a choice but to get up in the morning. I can stay in bed. I can not get up. And so I thought it was so much harder for her because she couldn't, she didn't have the reprieve. But again, again, this was very early on, and in I mean, within the f within probably six months of of Kristen dying, you know, Paula brings it out very clearly. You know, you still get up, you still get up whether you lost your only child or whether you have more, or wherever you are in your journey, and that's what you've seen over the years, and I've now seen too. You still get up. Maybe days where you just don't really feel like it, and but you still get up. Right. So parents proud of you for getting up.

SPEAKER_00 22:11

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 22:13

Another one is Donna Ashworth. She's a poet. And her Instagram is Donna Ashworth Word. So it's you know at D-O-N-N-A-A-S-H-W-O-R-T-H W O R D. Really great poet. I believe she's from Scotland, I'm not sure. But do you want to read one of those?

SPEAKER_00 22:43

Yeah, this is this is the one that resonates most with me, so

Love Came First And Moving With Loss

SPEAKER_00 22:47

I'm would love to read it. You don't move on after loss, but you must move with You must shake hands with grief. Welcome her in for she lives with you now. Pull her a chair to the table and offer her comfort. She is not the monster you first thought her to be. She is love, and she will walk with you now, stay with you now, if you let her, and on the days when your anger is high, remember why she came. Remember who she represents. Grief came to you, my friend, because love came first. Love came first.

SPEAKER_03 23:34

Okay, that one is so powerful. Here's what I'm gonna ask our listeners to do. As long as you are not driving, what I would like you to do is close your eyes. Kristen's gonna read that again, and I want you to visualize. Visualize what she is saying. That's what I was doing. So again, if you're driving, don't do it. Pull over, do it. But at some point, because I think this is so powerful, close your eyes and go with this and visualize these words.

SPEAKER_00 24:10

It's actually called love came first. You don't move on after loss, but you must move with. You must shake hands with grief, welcome her in, for she lives with you now. Pull her a chair at the table and offer her comfort. She is not the monster you first thought her to be. She is love, and she will walk with you now, stay with you now, if you let her. And on the days when your anger is high, remember why she came. Remember who she represents. Grief came to you, my friend, because love came first. Love came first.

unknown 25:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:02

I don't want to take away from what she's able to express there. Yeah. But I'm posting that on my background.

SPEAKER_03 25:10

Oh, yeah, share that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:11

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 25:14

And there's another one from her. There's so many from her, but there's another one that and this one's called Every Day. Losing someone is a journey, not a one-off. There is no end to the loss. There is only a learned skill on how to stay afloat when it washes over you. Be kind to those who are sailing this temptuous sea. They have a mission ahead of them and a daily shock to the system each time they realize they are gone again. You don't just lose someone once, you lose them every day for a lifetime because you love them every day for a lifetime.

SPEAKER_02 26:07

These are so good.

SPEAKER_00 26:09

They're so good. And just the way that she's able to express you love them every day. It's so similar to the not in redundancy, but just in this message of of course we will grieve. Of course we will grieve. You know, just I don't know if I was ready to hear that in the beginning. I knew it, but if anybody ever told me that it was going to become kind of just an integrated part of who I am, I would want to reject that. And both of these normalize grief in a way that they may land with people a little further out in their journey. I'd love to hear from someone in our comments about, you know, if one of these sets well with you, we want to hear, but we also want to hear if you think, I want to reject that. I don't, I don't like that, that sentiment. We want to hear that. This journey is so different for everybody. So if these thoughts they don't resonate with you, that's really meaningful for us to also reflect on that.

SPEAKER_03 27:17

There's so many more that she has. And so again, that's Donna Ashworth Word. Um, that's the Instagram page. One more Instagram page that we'll talk about. And there's there's so many out there, and there's some really good ones. So we'd ask you to, you know, jump on there, investigate these, and you may find something that we didn't cover or didn't have time to cover that really sits well with you. And the reason that we're sharing all of these is we just want to offer you another resource. Something that lands with you may not land with someone else. That's the unique part of this journey. And so we're trying to offer as many things as possible to help you as we walk beside you. So there's one, this one is from the Grief Table. Um, so that's at T-H-E-G-R-I-E F-T-A-B-L-E. Kristen, can you read one of those?

SPEAKER_00 28:11

One of the most powerful parts of grief work is understanding that love does not disappear when someone dies. It changes shape.

SPEAKER_03 28:21

Yeah, the love that I have for Kristen when she was walking on this earth has changed to the with the love that I have for her now that

Finding Support Through Shared Resources

SPEAKER_03 28:32

she's not here.

SPEAKER_02 28:34

It's still love and it's still powerful, but it is definitely different.

SPEAKER_03 28:42

It's different as time goes on and I evolve in the journey. When we mention time, it's not about time healing, it is time moves forward and we move with it, and our shape changes along the way. So take a look at some of these Instagram pages. If you want to get on ours, uh just don't forget to breathe podcast, and then you'll see that we may be reposting some of these. You'll see some um some of the follows that we have. Again, it's just more and more resources that we can provide that will help. And if there's some that you find that really helps you and really resonates with you, share those with us as well. As we talk about this is a community where we don't want anyone walking alone. And the more that we can support each other and share with each other, the easier this journey becomes. It's never easy, but it's easier that it becomes. So there's one I'm going to close with. This is one that I wrote, and this is about it's a summary, or it's kind of a poem of about a much longer story that I'll share probably on our website when we announce that. There'll be some things that we share on there, um, some different stories. This one is called When Grief Flips the Canoe. The river never asks if you are ready. Neither does grief. One moment I was paddling toward tomorrow. The next, I was beneath the surface, searching for air in a world that no longer made sense. People on the shore kept moving, laughing, working, living, while I learned how to breathe again. Some days I drift, some days I fight the current,

When Grief Flips The Canoe

SPEAKER_03 30:44

some days I swear the river will take me to. But then comes a bend, a sliver of sunlight, a hand reaching from the shore, a reminder that survival is not found in controlling the river, but in climbing back into the canoe and paddling on. Don't stop paddling, and don't forget to breathe. As we close today, we encourage you to seek out these writers and spend some time with their work. Sometimes one sentence, just one, can become an anchor on a difficult day. Grief has a way of making us feel isolated, but these voices remind us that we are part of a much larger community of parents who continue loving their children every single day. If one of these quotes spoke to you, we'd love to hear about it. Share it with us on social media, leave us a comment, or send us a message. And if there's another writer, poet, or grief resource that's helped you, please tell us. We want this community to keep learning from one another. Thank you for spending this time with us. Until next time, keep breathing, keep remembering, and never forget your child's story and your love for them continues. We'll see you next time on Don't Forget to Breathe.