Natalie's Story: When Grief and Joy Exist Together -E427

In this episode, Natalie shares the story of her daughter Brooklyn, a joyful, imaginative little girl who filled every space with life.

Through heartfelt memories and honest reflection, we talk about sudden loss, the early days of shock and numbness, and what it means to keep living while grieving a child.

This conversation explores how joy and sorrow can exist together, and how love continues to show up in everyday moments.

If you’re walking this road, this is a reminder, there is no right way to grieve… only your way.

Transcript

Welcome And What This Story Holds

SPEAKER_03 0:45

Welcome to Don't Forget to Breathe, the space where grieving parents find voice, hope, and connection. I'm Bruce Barker, here with my co-host, Kristen Glenn. Today's conversation is one that holds both deep heartbreak and incredible beauty. You're going to meet Natalie, a mom who shares the story of her daughter, Brooklyn, her princess, a little girl who filled every space with laughter, imagination, and joy. And like so many of us, Natalie's story shifts in an instant. What begins with memories that make you smile turn into the kind of loss that changes everything. In this episode, we talk about those early days of grief, the numbness, the shock, the guilt, and what it means to keep going when life feels completely out of order. But we also talk about something else. We talk about how love continues, how joy and sorrow can exist in the same moment, and how a child's presence doesn't end. It just changes form. If you're listening today in those early days, or somewhere along your own path, we hope this conversation reminds you that you're not alone and that there is no one way to walk this road. This is Natalie's story and Brooklyn's story as well. So wherever you are, take a breath and join us as Natalie tells her story. Natalie, thank you for coming and joining us today. We definitely appreciate that. So if you would, why don't you tell us about Brooklyn?

SPEAKER_00 2:28

Brooklyn was our princess. She's the youngest of our three kids. We have two sons in Brooklyn, and Brooklyn was the light of everything. She was a little bit of a surprise, and she just really could not have made our world more complete. She was fun and quiet. She didn't talk for a long time. She would whisper to people that she knew. And then when she started to talk, then it never stopped. She had has two brothers that doted on her every move, and she was all the things. She was a princess and a tomboy, and she loved dinosaurs.

SPEAKER_03 3:20

So both older brothers?

SPEAKER_00 3:22

Yep, both older brothers.

SPEAKER_03 3:24

The protective older brothers.

SPEAKER_00 3:25

Yes, very much so. They got her into all the things. I it's silly, but one day I remember looking down the hallway of our house, and the three of them are playing American Ninja Warrior along the walls in our house, and I'm like, none of my children are on the ground. They're all up in the air.

SPEAKER_03 3:53

What made her laugh?

Laughing Memories Dinosaurs And Capatillar

SPEAKER_00 3:55

Anything, mostly her brothers. But she also she was just she was quiet, and but anything was silly. She would do silly things. She loved, she just loved life. We would be in the car for five minutes and she would be ready to play the alphabet game in the car. You know, things were a little different then. The kids weren't on their phones so much, but with Brooklyn, it was like you were always doing something. She was always asking you questions about something. She was always playing a game. Life was just so full.

SPEAKER_03 4:33

What are some of your favorite memories with Brooklyn?

SPEAKER_00 4:38

So one year we were traveling to Texas for my son's football national tournament game. And we had to drive on Thanksgiving. And it was so funny, but the kids were done. The weather was bad. It was Thanksgiving. We had to have Whataburger for Thanksgiving dinner. Um, we were in the car for 22 hours, and the kids are all smushed in the backseat, all three of them. And all of a sudden, I see Brooklyn. She's like tucked up into her car seat, and her hands and her feet are together, and she starts bopping around. And we're like, What are you what are you doing, Brooklyn? She's like, I'm an egg. I'm hatching. And then she starts making these weird noises, and we're like, Brooklyn, what are you doing? She was a dinosaur. She was hatching as a dinosaur in our back seat.

SPEAKER_03 5:38

That is awesome.

SPEAKER_00 5:39

In the middle of a 22-hour drive. That's when a close second to that is Brooklyn, up until we lost her, she would not sleep in her own bed. Sometimes she was sleeping with the boys, but most of the time she would come into mine and Nate's beds. It was just at the time, hindsight, I never would have put her in her own bed. But at the time we were really trying to get her to sleep in her own bed. And she was six, but she would come out and mom, I have to go to the bathroom. And you'd take her to the bathroom and put her back into bed. Mama, I am just so thirsty. And you'd get her a drink and put her back to bed. Then we had done this a few times that night, and I look down the hall and I see Brooklyn, and she has a blanket over the top of her body. And I'm like, Brooklyn, you really need to go to sleep. Like you have school in the morning. And she starts like inching forward on the floor with this blanket over her head. And we hear this tiny little voice say, There's no Brooklyn here. I am a Capatillar. And she could not say the word caterpillar. And so everything was Capatillar. And so here came my little Capatillar down the hall at night.

The Sudden Loss And Early Shock

SPEAKER_03 7:06

Brooklyn, the princess, and Brooklyn the Capitoler. So we know a little about Brooklyn.

SPEAKER_02 7:15

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 7:16

Thank you for sharing those memories.

SPEAKER_02 7:18

Make me smile. Just imagine it. What are you comfortable telling us about those early days of the grief and the loss and what happened with Brooklyn?

SPEAKER_00 7:31

It was just really hard. It was so sudden. It was hard to have other young kids that we were trying to take care of all of them. And we were so young. We were young parents. We were just really lost. It was hard to know what was right and what was wrong. And we were really lucky. We just depended on our family and our friends and you guys.

SPEAKER_02 8:06

What do you remember, if anything, about the the emotions that happened right after? We we know we have listeners that listen soon after a tragedy has happened. And Brooklyn's accident was so sudden and so shocking. And to as a family, for you as a mom, what do you remember about those emotions of your grief journey?

SPEAKER_00 8:30

I remember just being numb a lot and kind of trying to just like forge our way through it. And just trying to keep things quote unquote normal and not not try to make big changes in our life for the boys. But I feel like early on it was just a lot of being numb and hiding in the corners and running upstairs when I just couldn't do it anymore. I tried really hard to make sure the boys knew like it was okay to be sad or in shock. I guess that's another thing is between being in numb just numb and and being in shock. I think it was a long time before I had other feelings other than that. You know, trying to get through the funeral and the service and then Christmas, and I think it was a long time before I had other feelings other than that. And with all of that came a lot of guilt. I felt guilt from the beginning, and then as things started to go along and time started to pass, then it was guilt for other things. As guilt for waking up in the morning.

SPEAKER_02 10:06

Losing a child is such a reversal of life, and for us to live and them not live feels so wrong.

unknown 10:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:17

Guilty that I'm here and my sweet girl's not.

unknown 10:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:23

Yeah. But at the same time, too, you know, trying to figure out how to honor her and keep keep life. She brought so much joy to us. Absolutely. I never wanted that to fade.

unknown 10:41

Yeah.

Grieving As A Couple And Parents

SPEAKER_02 10:43

When you think of your family unit and that trying to continue to be a parent when you were just so absolutely devastated and witnessing your husband's grief. How did you notice that the two of you needed to process the grief differently? Or the same.

SPEAKER_00 11:06

I always felt selfish. Nay was Nate is always my rock. And like always, he always put me in the kids first. So we grieved very differently, but then still together. Like it said, very selfishly, because he always just did what needed to be done with me and the kids.

SPEAKER_02 11:33

Kind of the protector role.

SPEAKER_00 11:35

Yeah, for sure. He was he constantly protecting and taking care of things. And it's hard. I think it was really hard to be in grief so early in life. And for us, we were still learning to be a husband and wife. And we were even though we had three kids, we were still learning to be a husband and wife, to be a mom and dad, to be a mom and dad to three kids. And so it was hard. It was really hard to I think it would be hard to grieve now at 40. You know, so to try to do it when we were 32 and not just grieve anybody, but grieve our precious princess. Right.

SPEAKER_02 12:25

Nothing can prepare you for that.

SPEAKER_00 12:28

No.

unknown 12:29

No.

SPEAKER_00 12:30

And it never stopped. I mean, obviously, like we still grieve, but our grief is still changing all the time. The boys' grief still changes all the time. Can you tell me more about that? I just think we've all grieved her very differently. So at first, you know, we were grieving this six-year-old princess that we very much missed just out of our daily life. Over the last few years, it's changed to grieving the person she would be. Um, Nate and I are empty nesters a lot earlier in life than we should have been. My oldest is engaged and planning a wedding, and we're grieving that, you know, maybe bridesmaid that that is missing.

SPEAKER_02 13:30

Yeah, that just gave me chills, Natalie, just to think of that forever void that is only Brooklyn's. No one can no one can feel that. And the planning of your son's wedding and the joy that I know you have surrounding that, and then the sorrow that that she doesn't get to experience that.

SPEAKER_00 13:52

It's hard.

SPEAKER_02 13:55

Have you felt lonely during this journey?

SPEAKER_00 13:58

Yes, and that feels selfish sometimes because I am so blessed, and I have amazing family and amazing friends, and I've made amazing friends who are on similar journeys or the same journey, and I am so blessed. I'm never actually alone, you know, Nate and the kids. But at the same time, nobody's ever gonna know. I think when you're on this path that we all seem to to find ourselves on, it's it's always different. There's something that's always different.

How Brooklyn Still Shows Up

SPEAKER_02 14:42

Yeah, it's only yours. You can kind of be in a room full of people, even if they love you dearly and still feel a bit alone.

unknown 14:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:52

Those are wise words that I think we can all can relate to.

SPEAKER_03 14:57

So, Natalie, what ways does your love for Princess Brooklyn still show up in your life today?

SPEAKER_00 15:04

Oh yes. Daily. I I think that most parents in our shoes say, you know, not a day goes by that we don't think about her, you know. I mean, I start my day thinking about her, I end my day thinking about her. She's very much present in everything that I do. But I also just I never stop talking about her. And I think sometimes that affects relationships or friendships in our world because people are afraid of that.

SPEAKER_01 15:40

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 15:41

They're afraid of the tears or the laughter, you know. But that's how I choose to just keep her here. We go out to see her, she has a beautiful bench and a beautiful headstone, and I very much decorate that every season of the year. Her stuff doesn't leave our house. It's very much present and open in our house. Her drawings, her things. When we go on vacations, we find things that she would love. And it's very much, I think, a comfort to us that somehow you can be on the other side of the nation and you're like, oh my gosh, Brooklyn would love this, or you find a toy that like relates back to her somehow. And to me, those are all just signs that like she's still with us in one way or another, and her presence will just very much never leave us. So we do. We go to the beach and we write her name in the sand, and we've been on a boat in the middle of the ocean and seen an animal we weren't supposed to see. And I think very much all of those are just, hey mama, I'm still here.

SPEAKER_03 17:05

What I think you're describing, or at least what comes up for me, is you're describing those moments of joy in the middle of your grief. So grief isn't gone, but joy's still there too. Do you find both sadness and comfort at the same time as well? How do those moments, how do they make you feel?

SPEAKER_00 17:25

I think as a family, we are successfully living. And that doesn't mean that we don't miss her because we very much miss her every moment of every day. But it is, it's just that like that perfect combination of comfort and joy. Like you said, it's sadness because she's not here, but then some comfort in knowing that, like in our own ways, we find her in everything that we're doing. And sometimes it is really hard, and sometimes it brings a lot of tears, um, which makes for maybe awkward moments sometimes when you're like, oh man, this makes me so happy, but I can't stop crying.

SPEAKER_01 18:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:11

But then also then sometimes the tears aren't present, and it's not because I don't miss her. Sure. But it is just finding that happiness in in that she's she's still here, she's still finding ways to to hug us or be in those moments.

Parenting Boys With Joy And Tears

SPEAKER_03 18:31

So it sounds like you're you're just stepping in to the moment, like you're you're very present with whatever that is. So whether again that that combination swirling around all at the same time, so the grief, sorrow, joy, laughter, tears, good tears as well, all at the same time. Am I getting that right? Yep. So you mentioned earlier about your oldest and you're planning a wedding. Same there as well. So all the joy that comes around that, you mentioned the loss of him not being there every day with you, but also the joy of this new family that's going to be starting. Like again, your joy and grief all at the same time, right?

SPEAKER_01 19:18

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 19:19

Is that what you would a message you might give to listeners who are on similar journeys, who may be in similar situations with other children, to let them know that that's okay, and that that's something you can you can speak to and say, hey, you know?

SPEAKER_00 19:35

Yeah. I think for sure. I think it's one of the things that has kept our family so close is I feel like, and I feel like my boys know we are always happy for them. And yes, we are always missing her, but it's just one of those things that we do is we find a way to incorporate her into all of these things. And and I let the boys choose that on their own doing. And if they want me to incorporate something that I want to incorporate, that's great. But I try to let them have control also because I don't want my grief or my things to take over their world or their events, but it is very much important to me to be excited and happy for the boys and for all of the things that they they are doing and the new lives that they're creating. And we just always still take her along with us. And you're right, sometimes it's happy tears, and sometimes it's sad tears, and but I just think it's been really important over the last eight years for us to just be really open with our kids and and they know that just because mom's crying doesn't mean this is that she's not happy for me, or that this isn't a happy moment. And I think and I hope that they understand that. It's something that we've worked really hard to to do. And I think it's been one of the most hard parts about grieving Brooklyn is not to not get overshadowed with Christopher and Justin, to not let the happy things be overshadowed.

SPEAKER_01 21:19

Yeah.

What Healing Means After Child Loss

SPEAKER_00 21:20

And I think that's a really hard battle, but I don't know. You just kind of do it and go with it and and hope that at the end of the day that they're okay with things and they still think I'm a good mom.

SPEAKER_03 21:35

So I know we talk about and we hear the phrase all the time about our grief journeys, right? And and some people are at different places when the word healing comes up. Would you say that you're on a healing journey as well, or does that not does it resonate with you or no?

SPEAKER_00 21:53

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 21:54

Hesitantly you say yes.

SPEAKER_00 21:58

It is hard. And I think I do want to say that we're healing. I just think that that healing isn't always what people think it is. I'm not healing in a way where I will ever go a day and be like, I feel fine.

SPEAKER_01 22:17

Right.

SPEAKER_00 22:18

Statements like life is good are hard, but you we do still make them because life life is good. One really bad thing happened to us, and it is really hard. But life is still good. And she made life good. She made life good not just in six years. She gave us memories that that last our entire lifetime. And so I think it's hard to say that that we're healing because sometimes I think that healing has a tendency to make me think like someday this will be gone, or someday this will be fixed, and it won't ever be fixed. We just navigate it in a different way, I guess.

SPEAKER_03 23:07

Yeah, it's like the we've talked about in previous episodes that it's a verb. There's not a destination to this. You're not gonna there's not a finish line. And it sounds like, and of course, this is all audio, viewers can't see this, but each time you speak of Brooklyn, even with your tears, there's the smile that's on your face is beaming. So given that, so what has helped you find those moments of peace again during this journey?

Joy Is Everywhere Final Wisdom

SPEAKER_00 23:36

I think I would just say like preserving her memories, carrying on her memories. Yeah. I was very, very afraid early on in my grief that I was going to forget things. So I would write down everything, everything I could remember, every silly memory, everything that I could remember that she said. I was so, so afraid to lose those. But the truth is, is that I haven't looked at that journal in years, and I don't forget them. And I tell those memories and those stories to different people. And I don't think there's people outside of the four of us that know all of them, but we find places to express those and remembering her and telling her stories brings us joy, you know. And sometimes times and places where it's hard to feel joy, she brings it easy. So it just it didn't matter whether she was here or not. Like she is a constant source of joy.

SPEAKER_03 24:43

You began with stories of your princess and your capital. What do you want our listeners to remember most about Brooklyn?

SPEAKER_02 24:58

Sorry, I'm struggling. Yeah, there's just so much. Maybe what what lesson has she taught you? I guess really just joy is everywhere and it's she finds it in the back of a car in a car seat going 22 miles, 22 hours to you know, and that says so much about her essence. Yeah. Right? That you can find joy even when you're stuck in the backseat with your brothers. Yes. Right? Yep.

SPEAKER_00 25:29

Laughter. Her laughter was so good.

SPEAKER_02 25:33

I remember one of your boys saying that your laughter reminded them of hers. And that touched my heart. Just to hear my mom laugh reminds me of my sister. You have a beautiful laugh. Fills the room. She sure did. It sounds like it. What wisdom do you have to share with people that are in those moments of thinking, how am I ever going to get through this? I'm like you said, I'm so numb. I'm so shocked. I feel guilt. I don't know if I want to wake up. What would you say to people that are in those dark, dark moments that all of us have gone through?

SPEAKER_00 26:14

I think it's really hard to hear, but it it's going to be okay. I I remember I didn't want to hear people say those things to me. And I didn't want to hear anyone else tell me that that somewhere the road was gonna be okay. But I think it's important to know and having in the back of your head that that it really is going to be okay, and not knowing why these things happen is hard. I'm a person who wants to know everything and understand everything, and so the unknown is just really hard, but I think it's just really good to know, like, even if you don't believe it in those early days, it is gonna be okay. And they're still gonna live on in your life in some way, and you're gonna find what's right for you.

SPEAKER_02 27:08

Such a wise comment to to end with what you're you're gonna find what's right for you. Because I think if people believe there's a certain roadmap or a one-size-fits-all or 12-step program, that's not how grief works. You know, it isn't. We all we all have to find our own path. And you've not only done that for yourself, but you've guided two incredible young men to to do that as well. That I've had the plev pleasure of knowing and keeping your family knowing that the grief surrounding Brooklyn isn't going to be overshadowed by their that they matter, that their joys matter, and that that sorrow can coexist with the joy that they can feel and don't have to feel badly that they're pursuing a life of joy, that that actually honors their sister. You guys have done that so beautifully.

SPEAKER_00 28:03

Thank you.

Love Does Not Leave Closing

SPEAKER_02 28:05

We're so honored to have you trust us with this very it's a difficult story, and then one that's full of the joy of Brooklyn. So thanks for for being with us today. Thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_03 28:18

Yeah, if you take anything from Natalie's story, let it be this Love doesn't leave. It shows up in the stories we tell, in the laughter that still echoes, in the moments that catch us off guard, and in the quiet ways we carry them forward every single day. Brooklyn is still here in her family, in their memories, in the way they live, love, and find joy, even in the middle of grief. And maybe you have a Brooklyn too, a room that feels different, a voice you still hear, a presence that never really left. However, your child shows up for you in memories, in signs, in the spaces only you understand, hold on to that. Because your way of carrying them, your way of grieving, your way of loving, it's yours, and it's enough. Thank you, Natalie, for trusting us with Brooklyn's story and for reminding us that even after the unimaginable, joy can still find a way in. To everyone listening, be gentle with yourself. Take care of each other, and please don't forget to breathe.